The Facebook kids meet the generals
Ursula Lindsey | Egypt Military youth Over at the We Are All Khaled Said Facebook group, there is a fascinating summary of the meeting between some of the young protest organizers and the military. The meeting included Ahmad Maher, Asmaa' Mahfouz (both from 6 April) Wael Ghonim, Khaled El Sayyid, Mohammed Abbas, Amr Salama and Abdul Rahman Samir, a Baradei supporter (not sure why all the members of the revolutionary youth council weren't there) and the post expresses the views of Ghonim and Salama.
I'm not going to translate the whole thing but here are some highlights:
The meeting is described in very positive terms: "We noticed an absence of paternalism in the conversation ('You don't know your own interest, son.') For the first time we sat with an Egyptian official who listened more than he spoke." Although the young participants did tell the military they should have a better media communications strategy (please! enough with these cryptic SMS messages).
This is what the military had to say:
- The military does not want power and thinks a civilian government is the only path towards progress. They only want to safeguard the gains of the revolution.
- Keeping the current government is place is necessary but only until it can carry out the needed changes.
- The military wants to see corruption pursued and prosecuted
- A constitutional committee will be formed during the next 10 days; a new constitution will be voted on in a referendum in 2 months.
- The military encourages the people to take steps towards forming new political parties
- The military will be holding meetings with representatives of all political forces
- They military will supervise a campaign to raise 100 billion pounds in donations repair the damages of the revolution.
- Egyptians need to go back to work, put their money back in the stock market, and attract tourists again
- Voting in the constitutional referendum and the presidential elections will be just with the national ID card
Ghonim and Salama take all this at face value and say they are convinced of the military's sincerity. There are some promising commitments here, but I am skeptical of several things: how deeply will the military, which controls enormous portions of the Egyptian economy, look into corruption? Why do they get to run a revolution relief fund (with which they will presumably contract themselves to rebuild the country's police stations, etc.)? Yes, the Egyptian economy is important; but this great and self-interested emphasis on getting things back to normal immediately could be detrimental to workers' rights in the long run (the military has said no one is allowed to strike). Last but not least:The military is taking meetings--that's good--but when are we going to see a truly consultative and democratic process put in place?
Reader Comments (14)
seriously, those guys seem altogether too naive. apart from your excellent criticisms, how do they think they're going to attract tourists back with military law in place? tourists also like to go out after midnight.
I'm also starting to wonder - the facebook kids are surely genius demo organizers, but they are not politicians. That's their strength and their weakness. Frankly, I would be cautious, to say the least, with army guys giving me sweet talk.
Politicians are made not born. I would welcome something a little rough around the edges rather than a smooth politician. Ultimately the army lives in Egypt too and want what is good for Egypt. If not, we would still have Mubarak.
Also, I'm glad the generals are being nice to the FB revolutionaries, but what about institutionalized commitments? How is talking to a group of hand-picked opposition reps without any accountability different from the kind of corporatism the Mubarak regime practised?
aliloon, I agree with your first point: politicians are made, not born, and the youth representatives will surely learn. But they may have to learn the hard way, when first delusions come. By the way, I notice that Wael Ghonim said he would not enter into politics, but this is what it is now: talking to generals is politics. I'm not blaming Wael, I think he's right to do it, but I am just wondering whether they realise that they will have to negotiate, and not only listen to what nice things generals have to say.
On your second point: I'm really surprised by the degree of trust many Egyptians have towards their generals. Well, the army has lived in Egypt for the past 30 years as well and had no problem with Mubarak until they were put under pressure. Besides, the role of the army during the uprising was more than ambiguous (failure to protect protesters several times; reports of arrests and torture by military secret services; have we forgotten about that?). One may rightly assume that they had no other choice but to eventually oust Mubarak to preserve their interests. We'll see thing more clearly when some light is shed on recent events.
Now, I also know why Egyptians have a positive image of their army, I understand it and I don't reject the human dimension: yes, generals also have a heart. But really, I think the situation does call for more caution. I do believe the army will eventually install a more democratic, civilian government (because other options don't look realistic), but the way it exactly looks like will be a tough political game.
Wha is going on now in Egypt? by Gualterio Nunez Estrada, cuban journalist and writer of Radio and TV.
The most serious problem facing the Egyptian Revolution and the military that seeking ways to support democracy and social justice is to feed eighty million Egyptians, guarantee safe drinking water, at least the minimum requirements of the UN. Another serious problem is to control the widespread corruption which was based on the tyranny of wealthy elites- Mubarak and his supporters. As business development, investment and speedy banking system could survive in a death sea of inequality and frozen domestic economy for large segments of Egyptian society that sometimes riots have made obtaining a loaf of bread? Opening to business as usual, creating employment opportunities, education for all citizens will be the most important challenge of the military generlals chief commander in Egypt and its test were the establishment of a democracy that actually works in civilian life where there would no third class citizens , fourth and fifth category..
THE WHOLE PLANET IS LOOKING AT THE EGYPTIAN ARMY.
Not only the countries of the Middle East but around the world, particularly the developing countries of the planet are looking the smart behavior and so the army of Egypt take care about this country to an economy in which all citizens have access and not just rich elites only and allied to corruption, embezzlement and the courts that apply only justice that the judge is paid under the table because it is not only an issue of freedom of expression or free election but it is fulfilled in real life of every citizen in the hope of a better world in their own country, without having to emigrate under lack of opportunity and a lot of discrimination.
EGYPT IS THE KEY IN INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS AND HAS A POWERFUL INFLUENCE ON THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY.
No current ideological moves in the Middle East but is born or adopted within the APROVAL OF Egyptian intelligentsia and its role in the area of energy supply to the West, in maintaining the security of Israel and for being the main factor in the solution the problem of Palestine, the whole international community is aware of what Egypt will do hereafter, absolutely no one will step on these issues without taking into consideration before the Egyptian position IS DUE and that is the case of the Palestine problem, to QUOTE one example . Gualterio Nunez Estrada, Sarasota, Florida, 34232.
I'm trying to figure out why these shabab seemed okay with participating in what looks like a clear Army attempt to pick the pro-democracy forces off one by one (and along the way set them off against each other.) Why go to this meeting alone?
Here is the full translation of the We Are All Khaled Said Facebook group's post on the youth movement's meeting with the Supreme Military Council:
http://jnthnwrght.blogspot.com/2011/02/generals-and-young-revolutionaries.html
The meeting reads like the military and middle class, well-educated young Egyptians working together to isolate the working class. Strikes have supposedly been endemic to Egpyt for several years now, and yet, a primary emphasis of the post-Mubarak leadership is the suppression of labor rights. And, are there are any indication that the workers are going to have any say in its preparation? Or, will the constitution lay the groundwork for the privatization of much of the Egyptian public sector? Is it possible that the sort of meeting described here may have its ultimate expression in the administration of "shock therapy" as first applied by Pinochet decades ago in Chile? As someone with limited knowledge of Egypt and its social life, I am concerned that we are about to experience a neoliberal transformation of the society with the military as the instrument for keeping the workers in line.
Please don't go back to your jobs! ! There are strikes all over Egypt, the fight is not over, don't sell out to the military generals! Our freedom is invested in the freedom of the people of Egypt, so continue your fight together
I agree with those who find the youth participants a bit naive, but honestly, I believe that comes from the suppressed lives they've lived. Hopefully they'll learn that being a little cynical is a good thing.
Also, I was slightly offended by Wael Ghonim talking about the young "guys" sitting with the generals. It's difficult for me to believe he "forgot" about the GIRL at the meeting, Asmaa' Mahfouz!!!!! Her uTube video proves her to be just as big a hero as the others at the table, but not surprisingly in a male concentric world, her name isn't championed as it should.
Wael is in m.a.r.k.e.t.i.n.g - don't lose sight of that, and he's marketing both himself and also trying to "brand" phrases such as Revolution 2.0, which not so coincidentally will be the title of his new book? I personally find that of all the young people, he is actually most promoting himself.
GO ASMAA' - you are a brave young woman, especially so in the male dominated Arab world!
We shouldn't expect the military to look into corruption - that should be up to the new government that forms. These talks should only be to take care of the interim details of impementing a structure that allows for an election.
I'm also extremely annoyed by the "Revolution 2.0" thing, and other "Facebook revolution", "twitter revolution"... Recently Wael Ghonim even compared the revolution to wikipedia - something in which "everyone contributes its piece" (well, this is I guess something common to all revolutions, which existed before wikipedia).
I don't think the guy is in marketing, but he might well be obsessed - that's his life after all. The web 2.0 was surely very useful, but eventually the real revolution was in the streets, not on the net. People leaving their offices, joining their neighbours, throwing stones and being shot at. It wasn't my revolution, but I'd still like it to be kept human.
Skepticism is necessary. These guys supported a dictator for 30 years. They own more than 80% of Egypt businesses, and now they are the ones protecting the dictator in his resort. If they are honest about what they are saying, give the country to the people who fought for its freedom,. ets investigate each one of them about their fortunes. They are part of the old regime while the poor little soldier is struggling to feed their families.